RE: 164 alternatives

["Mike Nakamura" <mike_nakamura@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

We have not owned an early 164 with the 12v heads, but our experience with
the Milano leads me to believe that the 12v heads have less expensive 30K
maintenance costs.

When we bought the 24v, we liked the power, dash controls and it had 28K
miles. The big thing is that we got a super deal on it. Has average repair
to RR door and frame, we never had it re-done because it was not that
important. It's a good car.

Each year we are spending a bit more, this is expected as items wear out.

I know that fixing an older car to "like-new" condition is still cheaper
than buying new (or new used). For our 164LS, here's what we are looking at
to make our 164LS a true daily driver.

Approaching 30K (120K) service, $ 1200 and up depending on what else needs
to be replaced. We have had 30K services close to $ 2600 when we replaced
muffler or suspension or brake parts.
Sunroof plastic part replacement, $ 630 plus paint scratch ($ 100 + when
done with other work).
Ignition interlock, we have temporary over ride in place. $ 598.
Plastic dash vents, $ 256.
Barb hates the rubber dam in the front (under radiator) that keeps pulling
out and dropping down, so the part and labor, not quoted yet.
AC system smell, hard to totally fix, replaced filter, need to use spray
mold and mildew killer.
Alarm not working correctly, red light blinks all the time even with alarm
off.
Dash LED's, live with it...
Paint, $2500
Stonegard, $600 (gotta protect the paint is you're going to the trouble of
painting)

Things we've done.
Strut bearings
Steering rack
New Radiator
New Heater core
Starter
The normal stuff... exhaust, brakes tires.

Say we spent $ 6000 on the 164, it would be in great condition and ready for
the next 30K miles.

We could drive it and fix it until??

Newer replacement, well you still have maintenance costs, depreciation.

Would newer be more reliable, not necessarily.

Newer has fewer "niggly" little problems? Most likely. Things like, do you
hear a fan bearing noise when the AC is on? When I turn full lock to the
left, is that an inner fender well scrape? Is the LR shock squeaking on
rough road? Sometimes the gas filler release doesn't open the first try. It
sounds louder, like the engine is "straining" more. I don't use the remote
locking, I don't trust it to work right all the time.

Such is the life of a somewhat older car.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: dsedon@domain.elided [mailto:dsedon@domain.elided]
Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2003 9:36 AM
To: "Jason Hagen"; mike_nakamura@domain.elided; alfa-digest@domain.elided
Subject: Re: 164 alternatives

hi jason,

ask anyone who has owned both varieties of 164 which is more reliable.  ask
alfa-bill, too, while yure at it.  the electrics on the '94 & later 164's
are a *lot* more of a pita...

re: a/c, try r12a in the system - much better than 12, let alone 134a...

agreed on having more than one car, tho!  :>)

regards,

doug s.
'95 buell s2, 90rwhp/ft-lbs torque, 33k
'92 alfa 164L, 203K
'88 alfa milano werde, 105k
'86 alfa gtwe6 3.0, 185k
'78 ducati darmah, 23k
'72 de tomaso pantera, 80k

"Jason Hagen" <hagen_jason1@domain.elided> wrote:

>Alright, I am finally going to enter this thread...
>
>I am completely astonished to hear someone suggest going from a '94 LS to a

>lesser 164 12-valve.  Where's the logic there?!  A little savings on a
>timing belt change?  Come on, the rest of the car would be older, and
>inferior (no offense), including electical, HVAC (R12), stepper, etc.


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