RE: Seat Belt Upgrade for Spider

["Tim Lentz" <timlentz@domain.elided>]

Original Question:
> Has anyone upgraded to shoulder harness seat belts in an
> early-mid 70's Spider? Is it a pain? Please send photos of
> what you did if you have them. Only really interested in
> stock looking upgrades, not racing stuff. Thanks

Brian Shorey's response:
> Find somebody (APE?) who is parting out a later Spider, or call Biba, who I
> believe is selling similar kits.

> The late model Spider components can be used in earlier cars.  Make sure
you
> get the right profile seat for the shoulder belt routing thing, the late
> model Spiders came with a couple different profile seats.

> Other than that, you need the belts and the rear mounting point - APE will
> cut them out for you (then you have to weld them into your Spider), not
sure
> what Bibas kit consists of.

Sorry, I'm late again ... got busy watching the "Rod Knock" title fight!
I was never real thrilled about the retrofit method suggested by Brian (no
offense). 1st - Depending on your source of parts, you will be using used
belts of unknown origin and unknown condition. 2nd - As Brian suggests, you
also need to have the later style rear anchor points welded into your car or
you need to engineer your own anchor points. Lastly - and most significant, in
my mind, is the seat issue. There has been talk on the digest before about the
earlier style seat not having the proper back support (internal) to support
the shoulder strap in an accident situation. Also, I know from sitting in my
'74 Spider (I'm 6' 0"), if I was using my stock seats with this system my
shoulder would become the highest point in space for the shoulder belt. And as
the shoulder strap traveled towards the rear anchor, it would be at a pretty
severe downward angle. I'm not a safety engineer, but I've always heard that
this could cause spinal damage if put to use in an accident. The later model
seats do have higher backs (and hopefully Alfa designed them with shoulder
strap safety in mind) and thus would be mandatory if it were my car.
So ... in my mind, the "proper" install would require: re-webbing of the old
belts, proper install of the rear shoulder strap anchor point and a retro fit
to a newer style seats (or new aftermarket seats).

After looking at the issues up, down and sideways for some time, I have gone
forward with a 3-point install into my '74 spider. The method I chose revolves
around the Autopower (street version) Rollbar. I can hear the moans starting
already ... there are those who say the "street bar" is nothing more than
looks ... BUT ... I say it provides three positives:
1) it adds some rigidity to a very flexible chassis
2) it does provide more rollover protection than NO BAR (say what you will
about the integrity of mounting points, lack of a diagonal brace, or the
limited height of the bar. BUT, If you knew you were going to roll and you had
your choice of either a Spider with a "street bar" or a Spider without ... I
know what line I'd be standing in)
3) the rollbar provides a virtual "B" pillar for the mounting of the should
strap "pivot" bracket for a 3-point seat belt system. The "pivot" can also be
located above the shoulder thus eliminating a "bad" rearward angle and the
need for other seats. (if this explanation is unclear, go look at the seat
belts in a Jeep Wrangler)

FWIW, I purchased brand new belts (A.S.C.P. safety certified) for $79 each
at:
http://www.newsales.com/seatbelt/standard_sofa_or_bench_seat.htm
I also had my rollbar modified (at the local roundy-pound race shop) to add
attachment points for the take-up reel (at the bottom of the main hoop) and
the "pivot" bracket (located approx. where the rear down braces meet the main
hoop).
I can send pictures to anyone that has an interest.

Tim Lentz
Tampa, FL
'74 Spider
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